[zainy]

Recently in the RMC most of the front runner I heard were running their karts with front brake, any comment or the different it made in term of performance. i plan to buy new chasis, which one should I buy with or without..

[Jules]

Zainy.....are u the zainy from Mykart?

its a tough question.....but if money not issue - get it and then u can spend time learning how to drive it. Mind you - you need front pads and also you need to know how to use the front brakes to not kill ur front tyres....

I am told, you dun use front brakes for every corner......so go figure-lar. Anyhow, I will let experts like Mikko & John answer u since I am really a newbie...

Btw, make sure ur new kart has a chamber adjustment kit - which is more important than the front brakes.

seems like everyone in mykart is getting new karts!

[zainy]

Zainy.....are u the zainy from Mykart?

its a tough question.....but if money not issue - get it and then u can spend time learning how to drive it. Mind you - you need front pads and also you need to know how to use the front brakes to not kill ur front tyres....

I am told, you dun use front brakes for every corner......so go figure-lar. Anyhow, I will let experts like Mikko & John answer u since I am really a newbie...

Btw, make sure ur new kart has a chamber adjustment kit - which is more important than the front brakes.

seems like everyone in mykart is getting new karts!

Thanks Jules and yes I am Zainy from mykart...this front brake thingy just playing in my mind...few guys in my kart might buy the kart with front brake and it cost about 4k more and its lots of money, don't know whether the money will be wisely spent..I planned to get my self the 2009 Intrepid.

One more think do i need new engine?..my engine quite old thou...

[Jules]

Zainy,

Its never easy when it comes to buying toys.......in any case, my advise is this :

1) always get a reliable engine 1st. A dead engine on a brand new kart will not get you anywhere. When u say ur engine is old - what's the issue? can it be solved? Dun be too hyped about getting the latest unless u r racing seriously ie. in RMC.
2) a kart chassis should not be too old ( 50mm rear axle at least ) and to the extend that its unreliable though but I can assure u John King's PDB which is 4 years old is still winning races. Anything less than 5 years is fine for an amateur and again, you know cos an old chassis will start falling apart too. There are some karts which can be upgraded to match the front guys and they are mostly on the front stub axles area....larger = better.

In the end, remember - perfect practise makes perfect drivers......and any competition will help, not just practising in circles.

Spend wisely! Of course if a brand new set up is within means, GO FOR IT!

Cheers,
Jules

[RocK]

if you getting a new kart, best to get it with Front Hand Brake (FHB).
It will be cheaper then say upgrading a kart with FHB. you're looking at 5k+ for the kit.

performance wise, its the way to go forward. when all the front runner using FHB, you need it to join the club.. GL

[Mikko Nassi]

New karters should make sure they don't start to rely too much on the front brakes. In fact if you're new and do get a kart with front brakes, I'd say don't use them until you can drive properly without them.

The great thing about only having rear brakes is that it really teaches you brake pedal feel. If you start with the front brakes you probably won't develop the same feel in your left foot for braking.

Remember that having brakes on the front doesn't just let you brake a bit later - it also changes the handling of the kart. If you use the front brakes too much you'll have the back end stepping out and you might think that the setup is off when it's actually the driver causing it .

All that being said in a race they are a definite advantage.

I should also add that I really don't like having front brakes in the Rotax categories. It makes overtaking more difficult (when everyone has them), it adds weight to the kart, and they add cost.

A rough estimate for laptime benefit around a track like Speedway PLUS is that they help at most 5 hundreths of a second(0.05sec) per lap. They will actually slow you down at first when you don't quite know how to use them.

[SOD]

New karters should make sure they don't start to rely too much on the front brakes. In fact if you're new and do get a kart with front brakes, I'd say don't use them until you can drive properly without them.

The great thing about only having rear brakes is that it really teaches you brake pedal feel. If you start with the front brakes you probably won't develop the same feel in your left foot for braking.

Remember that having brakes on the front doesn't just let you brake a bit later - it also changes the handling of the kart. If you use the front brakes too much you'll have the back end stepping out and you might think that the setup is off when it's actually the driver causing it .

All that being said in a race they are a definite advantage.

I should also add that I really don't like having front brakes in the Rotax categories. It makes overtaking more difficult (when everyone has them), it adds weight to the kart, and they add cost.

A rough estimate for laptime benefit around a track like Speedway PLUS is that they help at most 5 hundreths of a second(0.05sec) per lap. They will actually slow you down at first when you don't quite know how to use them.

Would I be incorrect if I said that there is a strong possibility that they will help tremendously at circuit with plenty of ups & downs in terms of the parameters of the circuit & harsh braking required at downhill hairpins for instance? I can think of a few circuits that may actually benefit you if that is the case & if it is the wet, then all the more so.
SOD

[JohnKing6]

Any time you do very heavy braking where the efficiency of the rear brakes is tested (in other words, where you're likely to lock up the rear brakes) having front brakes will help. They'll also help on circuits where you use the brakes so much you tend to overheat the rear brakes.

[ace]

To be honest, I don't even feel front brakes should be allowed in RMC. Just take a look at the Grand Finals, front brakes are not even used so why should the malaysians use it? It adds cost and may discourage potential competitors from competing.

[JohnKing6]

I agree with you but the regulations allow them so what to do....

[mlange]

Recently in the RMC most of the front runner I heard were running their karts with front brake, any comment or the different it made in term of performance. i plan to buy new chasis, which one should I buy with or without..

Zainy, if your just starting out on a Max, you could do without investing in front brakes. Bear in mind, these [new or 2nd hand] can always be purchased at a later date and retrofitted to the Intrepid you are looking at.

If its a choice of investing money into several alternatives that would improve lap times, there are definitely others which have a more immediate and beneficial effect; refreshing your 2nd hand engine. one-to-one lessons, instructional books on driving technique and mental preparation, working if a tuner to set up your kart & seat time seat time and more seat time.

Salient points in my opinion are:

(a) front brakes are costly and will not necessarily improve lap times
(b) front brakes may increase lap times on a Max since it can kill momentum which is key to driving fast in this class
(c) great in the rain, and if you are a heavyweight driver and on corners where you trail-brake into
(d) always an advantage in outbraking another driver not on front brakes but apply too much brake and point (b) applies

To be honest, I don't even feel front brakes should be allowed in RMC. Just take a look at the Grand Finals, front brakes are not even used so why should the malaysians use it? It adds cost and may discourage potential competitors from competing.

I believe Malaysia and other countries allow it as its permitted under Rotax regulations http://www.maxchallenge-rotax.com/regulations/pdf/RMC-RMCGF%20Technical%20Regulations%202009_20090820.pdf

3.1 Chassis:
125 Junior MAX- and 125 MAX classes
For national RMC's any chassis sanctioned by an authorised ROTAX distributor is allowed.
Chassis tubing : round tubing only.
Maximum diameter of rear axle = 50 mm, minimum wall thickness according to CIK-FIA rules.
At IRMCE and RMCGF chassis with a valid CIK-FIA homologation only are allowed.
Any brake system must have a valid CIK-FIA homologation.
Front brakes are not allowed In the 125 Junior MAX class.
Front brakes are allowed in 125 MAX class only.

Since we do not know why the manufacturers sponsoring the various classes have chosen not to add front brakes to their offerings in the Rotax Grand Finals, my personal guess would be due to the commercials of cost: whoever is paying for all that chassis (I've forgotten if it was Rotax, the Manufacturers or the organisers) ultimately has to sell them off right after the Finals at discounted prices. So reducing the initial capital outlay means a lower capital loss upon sale.

[JohnKing6]

I believe Malaysia and other countries allow it as its permitted under Rotax regulations http://www.maxchallenge-rotax.com/regulations/pdf/RMC-RMCGF%20Technical%20Regulations%202009_20090820.pdf

3.1 Chassis:
125 Junior MAX- and 125 MAX classes
For national RMC's any chassis sanctioned by an authorised ROTAX distributor is allowed.
Chassis tubing : round tubing only.
Maximum diameter of rear axle = 50 mm, minimum wall thickness according to CIK-FIA rules.
At IRMCE and RMCGF chassis with a valid CIK-FIA homologation only are allowed.
Any brake system must have a valid CIK-FIA homologation.
Front brakes are not allowed In the 125 Junior MAX class.
Front brakes are allowed in 125 MAX class only.

Since we do not know why the manufacturers sponsoring the various classes have chosen not to add front brakes to their offerings in the Rotax Grand Finals, my personal guess would be due to the commercials of cost: whoever is paying for all that chassis (I've forgotten if it was Rotax, the Manufacturers or the organisers) ultimately has to sell them off right after the Finals at discounted prices. So reducing the initial capital outlay means a lower capital loss upon sale.

Exactly Mark - Rotax (and it's appointed chassis vendor) aren't prepared to make the investment in them for the Grand Finals but they don't mind forcing drivers to spend the extra money to remain competitive. They add 20% + to the cost of a chassis and 3kgs (a serious disadvantage for heavier drivers which just about negates the advantage of them).