[valente]

Damn. if they were to start a championship in Malaysia, the least they could do is serious and organized about it. But could it be because of local authorities? cause i have this inclination that the Malaysia authorities not really keen on foreigners into their markets??

[Mikko Nassi]

No I don't think that issues similar to last year can be blamed on local authorities. Using for different makes/types of tyres over 4 weekends is because of a lack of proper planning and can't have anything to do with local authorities. I mean we ran on 3 sets of tyres I don't think I had never even heard of before. Also local authorities don't tell you to change your regulations mid-year without asking drivers about it.

Right now the Rotax Series does seem properly organised - last year there was a real screw-up towards the end of the year which resulted in no Malaysian going to the grand-finals but now it is organised by a different group and they seem to be lifting the image of the series already.

[Alex Ritchie]

I was so glad when my son moved out of the cadet class (he graduated to Junior Max a year early). The problems in the class then (2003 - 04) were cheating, reliability and cost.

The policing system placed the onus of catching the cheats squarely on the chief scrutineer. You prepared the engines, brought them to the races where they would be sealed, raced and then waited to see if the scrutineer would open them up for inspection. One racer from Singapore was caught cheating 4 times - thrice in Malaysia and once in Macau. When he did not get caught he usually ended up on the podium...

We used to carry three engines to each race weekend and usually by the final none of them were working to peak performance. It was a nightmare!

Over the two years there were a couple of good proposals to deal with the issues, but none were actually implemented:

(i) Appoint one organisation to supply all the engines. They would prepare and rent the engines, which would be allocated by ballot.
(ii) Legislate that all the engines were for sale at the end of the race weekend at a fixed price. This would discourage spending on exotic carbies, specialist builders and the like for obvious reasons.
(iii) Each driver had to contribute two engines into a pool. Engines would be allocated to teams by ballot. After the race engines would be returned to the owners for rebuild.

For the sake of the wallets and sanity of the parents I think a move to a touch and go engine policed in the same manner as the Rotax Challenge is the way to go - Baby Rok or Mini Max.

[Raja Razman]

Firstly hi to everyone

when we mention grip, speed, faster or slower and 60 n 80cc engine.
All the above have to do with your child physical strength. If he or she is just stating in karting then 90percent chance they are unfit for kart racing but for normal karting or kart-playing to the kids, they are fine.

To move from playing to racing takes alot of commitment from manager and driver- especially the driver.
So parents ask your driver what they want first before even buyimg a new helmet.
Kart playing is cheap and safe but need some work initialy.
Kart RACING SHOULD BE CONSIDERED AFTER 3-6 MONTHS OF KART PLAYING.

[Mikko Nassi]

Right on Razman, great post!

You bring up the important point that some kids 8-12 yrs old aren't even strong enough to handle the Cadets we have now when driven at a fast pace - the tyres have a lot of grip in them. This problem isn't so big with narrow low-grip tyres.

And also good point about the driver wanting to race... many parents without even realizing it might be pressuring their kid to drive karts. It is usually quite obvious in how the driver approached driving when this happens - then of course there are the kids that really just beg to race karts, for example the way Mark described his daughter's enthusiasm.

And finally 3rd point you brought up was that you need to practice before heading out to a race - I couldn't agree more. Many drivers make the mistake of taking part in a race after only say 2 weekends of practice and then they get lapped in the race and lose confidence and give up quickly.

(i) Appoint one organisation to supply all the engines. They would prepare and rent the engines, which would be allocated by ballot.
(ii) Legislate that all the engines were for sale at the end of the race weekend at a fixed price. This would discourage spending on exotic carbies, specialist builders and the like for obvious reasons.
(iii) Each driver had to contribute two engines into a pool. Engines would be allocated to teams by ballot. After the race engines would be returned to the owners for rebuild.

Alex that's a lot of interesting insight! When I raced in an 85cc category we actually had the cc checked after the race and this was simple club-level racing where most drivers were on 5-year old chassis. It was done by pouring a nifty liquid into the engine and then pouring it back out and measuring it - really fast and no need to even open the engine. Also great suggestions to control it - I'm a big fan of sealed engine with tight control.

[Jules]

No I don't think that issues similar to last year can be blamed on local authorities. Using for different makes/types of tyres over 4 weekends is because of a lack of proper planning and can't have anything to do with local authorities. I mean we ran on 3 sets of tyres I don't think I had never even heard of before. Also local authorities don't tell you to change your regulations mid-year without asking drivers about it.

Right now the Rotax Series does seem properly organised - last year there was a real screw-up towards the end of the year which resulted in no Malaysian going to the grand-finals but now it is organised by a different group and they seem to be lifting the image of the series already.

Well Mikko, I was there with you and I share your frustrations.

Tyre swapping at their free will was bad but the of the tyres esp that from Rd 4 & 5 was ummm.......

Not wanting to name anyone specific, I think we karters take a lot of shite to indulge in this sport.

For this year - the complication arose from unpaid sponsorship monies from LAST years championship......again, no need to say who but the sad fact is everyone like you and me - waits. Darn!

Let's hope the organisers better clean up their act.....any championship, for the sake of the sports.

Peace!

[Jules]

Firstly hi to everyone

when we mention grip, speed, faster or slower and 60 n 80cc engine.
All the above have to do with your child physical strength. If he or she is just stating in karting then 90percent chance they are unfit for kart racing but for normal karting or kart-playing to the kids, they are fine.

To move from playing to racing takes alot of commitment from manager and driver- especially the driver.
So parents ask your driver what they want first before even buyimg a new helmet.
Kart playing is cheap and safe but need some work initialy.
Kart RACING SHOULD BE CONSIDERED AFTER 3-6 MONTHS OF KART PLAYING.

Yes, speed is relative and it all means nothing if the kid losses his momentum after a few tries. AND this has happen many times from what I see, even to adult karters....

Guys, this is a sports and make no mistake - it takes dedication, discipline and money to excel.

So in summary - sticking to ur topic, no matter what class/engine - we want reliability, ease of maintenance/ attractive pricing for engine & parts cos the biggest problem are always these.....plus keeping the little fella interested!

Yes, standard seal engine is the way to go.....

[Mikko Nassi]

Yes, speed is relative and it all means nothing if the kid losses his momentum after a few tries. AND this has happen many times from what I see, even to adult karters....

Guys, this is a sports and make no mistake - it takes dedication, discipline and money to excel.

True- have a look at Australia - you aren't even allowed on a 125 TAG kart in your first year of karting because they know many can't handle it and the racing is better if you start on something slower.

So you can imagine if a kart is too fast for a kid - and too physical to drive - they lose interest because they're having a tough time.

[Alex Ritchie]

Alex that's a lot of interesting insight! When I raced in an 85cc category we actually had the cc checked after the race and this was simple club-level racing where most drivers were on 5-year old chassis. It was done by pouring a nifty liquid into the engine and then pouring it back out and measuring it - really fast and no need to even open the engine. Also great suggestions to control it - I'm a big fan of sealed engine with tight control.

The cheating when my son was racing was more complicated than a simple increase in cc. The rules were "standard engines" - a good idea as it would reduce costs.

But with "standard engines" even small mods made a noticeable difference. The usual methods were high speed crankshaft bearings, small improvements to the ports, increasing compression ratio through shaving the block and so forth.

The main problem is the way the rules were policed. The clubs usually took the path of least hassle - let everyone race, post the results and see what happens. This had the effect of transferring the responsibility to the parents - "if you do not agree with the results then you should protest".

Most competitors are very reluctant to protest. After racing for a while you become friends with the others. And who would like to earn a podium spot through a protest on a friend?

So preparing for every race became an ethics test - should I cheat? How much should I cheat? Can I get away with it if I cheat? If I do not cheat my son will be left far behind...

Raja Razman had the best solution of all - when he ran the KBS races he stripped all the podium finishers, without exception. Caught a few cheaters, even one in Rotax Junior with sealed engine in the first race meeting.

For the next meeting lap times of some competitors dropped noticeably, so you can draw your own conclusions...

[Mikko Nassi]

Looks like the cheating issue is out of control enough that it has to be dealt with. Yes stripping the engines is a good way. Another alternative to always opening the podium finishers is for example to strip the top two always + 1 kart selected at random (for example before the final stewards decide that P1 and P2 + P5 will be checked).

In Finland they also stripped engines somtimes and CC check was a really quick method without the need to open the engine that was so easy there was no point not doing it now and then.

Fair enough it takes a bit of time to check engines but if cheating is controlled the racing will be better and there will probably be more competitors.

[RocK]

so what happen to the karters who caught cheating? dont they get ban for cheating?

[CRG Asia]

I think they are just asked to make the changes, I don't suppose they immediately get disqualified. However the only person that know for sure will be Mikko.

So mikko, comments?

[Mikko Nassi]

Actually I don't know.

The people that got disqualified would know.

I do remember back in about 2000 when racing in the stock standard piston ports a guy was caught with some polishing in the ports and was disqualified - yet in the very next race he used the same cylinder and won but wasn't disqualified. It's been a while so I might remember things a bit wrong but you can imagine what that and similar things did to the confidence of drivers in the category as a "stock standard" category.

[RocK]

a guy was caught with some polishing in the ports and was disqualified - yet in the very next race he used the same cylinder and won but wasn't disqualified.

Ah then AAM is the problem. No wonder they dare to cheat. should at least try yellow card & red card thingy. yellow card for 1st offense, red card if got caught again meaning ban. how long is another subject i think..

[Jules]

a guy was caught with some polishing in the ports and was disqualified - yet in the very next race he used the same cylinder and won but wasn't disqualified.

Ah then AAM is the problem. No wonder they dare to cheat. should at least try yellow card & red card thingy. yellow card for 1st offense, red card if got caught again meaning ban. how long is another subject i think..

No so much AAM but the organisers. For the races Mikko mentioned were held by KKS....so you go figure. KKS canned that class after 2 years and Mikko plus a few other good drivers came from that standard class racing.

At last years AKOC - all our Rotax karts got impounded after the race and I did see the scrutineer ( Suzuki san? ) was opening some engines and used a go no go gauge....

To be honest, the club must enforce this strictly for such class to survive and its not so hard. They must however train their scrutineer to do the job properly and not leave things to the eye etc. Simple Go/No go Gauges should be used and once they start penalise ppl and even banning or give out a fine - everyone will just try their luck.

For those who stick to the standard specs, and if they win - will be accused of cheating by their fellow drivers. I know, I was in that spot immediately after beating one driver fair and square.....sad.

Anyhow I think we are on a wrong thread to bring this further.....