[Sheridan Thomas]

With reference to Rookie' Comments about the Master's Rolling Starts in the Singapore National Championships in Rd1.

The Masters Class has a lot of very experienced Karter's taking part, some with over 20 years Karting Experience.
During the Rolling Start I controlled the pace and had spoken previously to the SMSA as to when it is legal to start the Race, '' Upon Entry into the Straight when the Green Flag is Waved ''

Everybody entered the last corner before the straight in formation with nobody pulling away unfairly and I did not accelerate until I saw the Green Flag being waved, I pulled away quickly in all of my Heats,PreFinal and Final so it may of gave you the impression that I was ahead earlier.

This was a perfectly legal start otherwise the SMSA Officials would of requested another rolling lap and I would of obliged. To call them a '' Joke '' is unfair and unjust and you are welcome to participate in both disciplines of Marshalling and Racing to improve it.

The Masters Class is in fact where the most entries are and some of the most experienced drivers are and my lap times were the fastest of the weekend inclusive of all classes.

I would be interested in racing you if you are an expert?

[Mikko Nassi]

If you actually read the regulations, the race only allows people who have grade C license and grade B license. Richard has a grade A license which is why he was not allowed to race.

That's good to know. All he has to do is downgrade to a B license .

To be honest Kyme, there are also cheating in Rotax in Malaysia. Just that the organisers know how to not make it too obvious. Just look at Storm karts, they are not homologated but they are allowed in RMC. According to CIK regulations, all chassis used must be homologated. Why are they allowed? Because the organiser sells them.

I guess I should reply here since I'm the one "cheating". As you mentioned it's a good idea to read regulations before you make accusations. This regulation has been in place for several years in RMC events. Drivers have raced non-homologated KnK karts before for example. The organiser didn't sell those karts. The RMC is also not as strict on out-of-homologation karts. As long as the karts are safe (brakes etc) there is no reason to force competitors to buy new homologated karts. It allows for slightly cheaper racing. They still have to meet the CIK regulations as the Storm kart for example does - it just isn't homologated.

Any other non-homologated karts that meet the CIK regs and are deemed to be safe (as James said no backyard karts) are allowed to race. I think CRG and Birel both have some cheap non homologated models?

If you feel that there is cheating going on in the RMC (other than this chassis issue which is completely legal), please let the organisers know precisely what it is you think is going on and they'll be sure to look out for it at the next round.

And come on, please don't give the Singapore organisers so much stick. They are still in the process of learning and as jonbummer said, Malaysian races weren't as organised as they are now either.

Agreed! As I said I hope that they are open to learning and accepting constructive criticism from competitors - that's how they'll improve.

In AKOC, the fuel tanks are kept just like tyres, thats how it rolls in international CIK events. Also, the marshals at RMC are part timers and are quite useless to be honest, I could push out a driver at a turn and wouldn't even be disqualified. Try that at AKOC and see what punishment u get.

I don't think there is much difference in AKOC in driving standards compared to RMC - I have a fair few pictures of pushing going on in AKOC as well that went unpunished - to be fair that was a few years ago so things might've changed. My experience is pretty much the same from both series' - not enough enforcement of bad driving behavior. I have seen one driver DQ'd from a final in RMC for pushing, and I've also seen a 10 second penalty or two . At most events I go to I always try to encourage the COC to use the black/white warning flag more often if I chat with them - it isn't used enough in almost any series imo. There is no immediate punishment (so if the COC/marshals get it wrong it's not too bad) but it shows the drivers they're being watched.

As to marshals it usually depends where you are racing, since marshals rarely travel with the series. The KKS marshals in general do a pretty good job (they organise the RMC events in Malaysia). The no.1 issue is how well the COC has briefed them and how well communication flows from the COC to marshals and the other way.

I guess fuel impounding and control fuel/oil could be an additional step in RMC - in addition to the fuel samples/testing that is already done. One reason it isn't done at the moment is to save on costs/complication for competitors. Cheating with fuel is still quite easy even when fuel is impounded - just bring along your additive in a water bottle .

[Mikko Nassi]

Sheridan welcome to the forums. I also didn't see anything particularly wrong with the masters start in the video posted. Congratulations on the win.

And don't sweat it - if the pole position driver realizes that the COC isn't being very strict on starts it is only smart to try to gain an advantage at least at the first start attempt. As you said it's the COC's duty to make sure the drivers know how they're supposed to start and if he doesn't like the formation make them go around again.

[Shadow]

How does Sheridan knew that everybody entered the last corner before the straight in formation when he was right in front of the pack? Everybody can see that you are at least 5 to 10 karts length ahead when the green flag is waved.

You are not wrong in taking advantage of it but it does not mean that the start is correct even though the green flag is waved. It is starting marshal that do not know how to do their job properly.

Why the SMSA officials do not request another rolling lap is because they themselves do not what is a correct start.

[ace]

Well, why would the competitor be incurring cost when there is fuel standardization? Aren't they paying for fuel and 2T now when there is no standardization? When you provide the standard fuel mix and charge the competitor, won't they be saving on buying the fuel themselves? So it is the same actually. In fact, it saves the competitor the trouble of going out to buy fuel and carrying the heavy tank and everything.

Well, I can suggest an easy way of preventing your water bottle stuff, do what KymeHallion likes to do, seal it.
Seriously speaking, during races, the impounders are not doing anything anyway. They can easily spend the time fueling up and sealing it. And by sealing, I am just saying maybe 2-3 rounds of wrapping the fuel cap to the tank with something as simple as duct tape. If you want it even safer, you can use the markers used for tyre marking to mark the duct tape. In parc ferme, should someone be tampering or removing the tape, I think it would be quite obvious for a marshal in the parc ferme to notice. If not, should it have been removed and replaced, I think it is quite obvious to the impounders to notice after the race.

[Mikko Nassi]

Well, why would the competitor be incurring cost when there is fuel standardization? Aren't they paying for fuel and 2T now when there is no standardization? When you provide the standard fuel mix and charge the competitor, won't they be saving on buying the fuel themselves? So it is the same actually. In fact, it saves the competitor the trouble of going out to buy fuel and carrying the heavy tank and everything.

Sorry I didn't mean the fuel itself would cost any more - although that is usually the case because organisers bump up the price;) An extra fuel tank is usually required for morning warm-up with fuel impounding - and in some cases for friday practice (if fuel tank has to be impounded earlier).

For overseas competitors it usually does cost a bit more because they have to purchase practice fuel + race fuel separately and end up with a fair bit of excess they can't use .

If you're going to go with fuel impounding you also need tighter control/more observers in the parc ferme area, and improved facilities (otherwise the fuel impounding is rendered worthless) = more officials = more cost.

I am just saying maybe 2-3 rounds of wrapping the fuel cap to the tank with something as simple as duct tape.

Tape around the fuel tank? This process would have to be repeated after every heat = competitors first have to take off the tape and then an official has to observe the re-filling of the tank of all (up to 36 competitors) and then put it back on?

The best way is of course to have the fuel filled up by officials (more officials needed, and also more impounding area + proper fencing on the impounding area.. which all cost a lot of $$$ to est up as almost no tracks in this area are equipped for it). At the Macau CIK KF1 event as well as all other events I've raced (besides rotax gf) at it would've been very easy to put anything in your fuel (I've never had my oil bottle checked for example before I mix it).

The only place I've seen this done properly is at the Rotax Grand Finals. The competitors never get to fill their own fuel tanks - you simply hand your tank to the officials and mark it with where you want it filled up to. In addition to this and most importantly all karts + trolleys are checked to make sure nothing other than the allowed tools (water is allowed ) are brought in to the parc ferme/impound/pre-grid area, and there is proper fencing around the areas to make sure nothing is snuck in. In addition to that there is an official or two walking around looking at what mechanics are up to. All that adds up and the cost is eventually passed on to the competitor.

That makes simple random fuel testing seem by far the best choice to control fuel. Without all the above in place impounding fuel tanks simply creates an illusion that a problem has been taken care of while creating extra work for competitors for no benefit. There was fuel impounding at the Rotax event in Indonesia but it seemed pointless to me because there was no control, and not enough space in the pre-grid for competitors and no fenced off parc ferme.

Ace any comment on the non-homologated karts or what other cheating is going on in RMC? Btw I had a look at the AKOC regs and AKOC also correctly follows this rule for Rotax Senior (Chassis must be CIK homologated or sanctioned by the authorized Rotax Distributor. Maximum diameter of chassis tubing 32.0 mm rounds tubing only). So Singapore is the only place in the region I can't use my Storm kart with a Rotax engine . Don't worry I probably won't be using it at the next round anyway.

One big thing of note between the Singapore Championship and AKOC = in AKOC while Rotax runs together with KF engines they are still scored separately in the championship. There is a "Rotax Senior" champion separately. This is probably why they don't equalise the weights more - the drivers aren't competing against each other in the championship. Singapore has copy pasted the regulations but missed out some important parts.

...argh I don't know how to split this topic up - we're not really talking about the Singapore KC anymore lol.

[engine1]

kymehallion maybe you should'nt use your real name because, most people on the site are not game too, including me !
I was there at the race and watched the same video online by Mark, just a little fast at the front!!!!!!! SMSA will take time to get better and Dads should let the Kids just have fun......

[mlange]

I took snapshots of race results for some of the later sessions

prefinal/final race timings at http://kartingsingapore.com/wp/?p=1113

[Sheridan Thomas]

Hey Mikko, Thanks for the warm welcome and thanks for the compliment on my races!

In resonse to the question '' How did Sheridan know everybody was in formation coming into the first straight '' as I was in Pole.
On Sunday we had several members of Williams Racing ( My Team ) positioned around the Track to monitor and give indications to myself whether the Formation I was controlling was correct as I wanted the best possible legal start.

My guys are all professionals and gave me the thumbs up at each position for each race. , You may have the impression that I jumped the starts because of the way we have set my kart up... ( Super Quick )

What we all should appreciate is the hard work of the SMSA and Kartright Speedway, The officials and Marshals worked tirelessly in the extreme heat for the entire weekend and it has to be remembered that they are volunteers. They made all our fun over the weekend possible along with the usual professionalism from Allan's Team at Kartright.

It is very easy to say '' Dads should just let their kids have fun '' until your son or daughter actually starts racing, It is an emotional rollercoaster from start to finish for the parents . It is after all Racing and not Fun Karting and you have to be competitive to succeed.

When your son or daughter is in tears for something you feel is unjust in the Race you will understand what I mean and it can turn the most mild mannered Father into the '' Incredible Hulk '' ..

I would like to thank all the officials from the SMSA Kartright for the weekend and cannot wait until the next race!!

[Ryan104]

If a driver is on pole and that driver knows that there is a high chance the race starter will let the race start even if there are jump starters from behind or besides, then you would naturally have to be the first one to accelerate and take control of the situation otherwise you will just be swamped by the competitors around you. This is why you may see fast starts in this region. Solution is to follow what CIK do with the leaders having to be in between a speed frame(min/max) on to the main straight for the start and all drivers sticking in between lanes before the green light is shown. Otherwise if there is no enforcement of this kind of start procedure, there is a lot of driver tactics at the start of the race on anticipation of the start marshal and this is just part of the game.

[jonbummer]

On Sunday we had several members of Williams Racing ( My Team ) positioned around the Track to monitor and give indications to myself whether the Formation I was controlling was correct as I wanted the best possible legal start.

My guys are all professionals and gave me the thumbs up at each position for each race. , You may have the impression that I jumped the starts because of the way we have set my kart up... ( Super Quick )

first thing first, a good win there. even though I was rooting for my fren who came in 2nd,
the way u pulled away and estab a gap is great!

thinking out loud.... is it okay for others to have their guys positioned around the track as well?

because if only William Racing can deployed people around to help their own drivers is it not some kind of a "unfair advantage" ?

i hope this is a valid qnn, hence forgive me if it seems silly or ignorant.

cheers

[Sheridan Thomas]

Hey Jon,

Thanks for the compliment

My guys were only around the Track for the Rolling Starts as we were anticipating the rest of the pack making flying starts around the first corner as well and we wanted to maintain my advantage.

This is just a normal part of racing as we will try to gain every legal advantage possible

Your guy who was second would have given me a great race for the duration and the only reason he didn't push me was one of the guys he was lapping gave him a signal to overtake after seeing the Blue Flag and then closed the door on him!!

That allowed me to pull away effectively sealing the weekend for me and ending the Race for Paul.

Also had Ben Goh who came in third had more luck in his Qualifying ( Held up by Slower Guys ) definately would of been in contention for 2nd.

I don't think it gave me an unfair advantage it was just an additional measure we took in preparation to make sure no-one got the start on me whicj has happened before.Everybody can adopt the same measure of protection.

I have a little surprise for the next round in May as I have further increased my Fitness and Nutrition Program and coupled with Technical updates should see us get through the 33second barrier for the lap times. I hit 32:98 last night in practice with the adjustments but it takes a lot more Endurance to maintain the pace.

I am sure Ben and Paul will be making similar adjustments which will make for a memorable weekend at Kartright!!

[ace]

My guys were only around the Track for the Rolling Starts as we were anticipating the rest of the pack making flying starts around the first corner as well and we wanted to maintain my advantage.

This is just a normal part of racing as we will try to gain every legal advantage possible

In international races, even in malaysia, this isn't allowed. It is part of racing that some people have better start techniques than others. If you are so scared of people accelerating faster than you, then accelerate faster! In Singapore track, with the slow last corner, a tactic that many faster drivers will do (and it is no secret) is to have a relative faster formation lap and den go very slow into the last corner and den accelerate. When the 2nd guy slows down, you accelerate. That then is racing! The thing about pole is only that you get the inside line. Not really about having your nose infront. Of course, the 2nd guy should not have his nose infront but if it is by just a foot or less, normally it is ok. I expect you don't have much real racing experience so it is ok for first time.

Your guy who was second would have given me a great race for the duration and the only reason he didn't push me was one of the guys he was lapping gave him a signal to overtake after seeing the Blue Flag and then closed the door on him!!

I saw that. It was Jonathan Tay, the Drakar team boss, who was effing slow. I find it strange that he made the cut for the final. He pointed for Paul to go through and then started closing him, causing him to hit the grass and spin. Luckily he managed to recover and not get stuck, or else I think people would've been very very angry.

I don't think it gave me an unfair advantage it was just an additional measure we took in preparation to make sure no-one got the start on me whicj has happened before.Everybody can adopt the same measure of protection.

Again, that is racing. In the senior prefinal, Opai had a better start and was in 1st before the 1st turn even though he started in 2nd. All Andrew did was to just admit that he did not have a good start and analyse from there and not ask his mechanic to stand around the track. That's from experience. You can't avoid that others may have a better start. You can't say, imagine, that your carb floods and others must wait and can't accelerate right?

I have a little surprise for the next round in May as I have further increased my Fitness and Nutrition Program and coupled with Technical updates should see us get through the 33second barrier for the lap times. I hit 32:98 last night in practice with the adjustments but it takes a lot more Endurance to maintain the pace.

I am sure Ben and Paul will be making similar adjustments which will make for a memorable weekend at Kartright!!

Wow! All these just for the Singapore Karting Championship in a "street track"? If you are having such programs, at least compete in the malaysian series', such as RMC or Yamaha, where you will meet the "real racers" in this region. Even some of them don't have such regiments. Technical updates? This is karting not F1 dude. Relax on that. I'm sure Ben and Paul aren't fully concentrating on SKC anyways since I heard that they are focussing on AKOC this year. They probably race there since it is in Singapore and isn't too far from where they stay. For a fact, I know they don't rebuild their engines about once or twice a month and run it very lean, which is what Williams Racing is doing which makes their engines slightly better.

[jonbummer]

1st of all, Ace, it is no doubt KR is a small track and not CIK sanctioned

but it is rather physically demanding through the last technical sections.
let's not go into whether we had even race there.

all i can say it's tougher than it looks

so let's not 'belittle' those who had decided to give our national race some support la

i do agree having people standing ard the track is still a bit of a advantage.
BUT, one still need to be in the position, i.e. 1st row start, to take advantage of it.
so hat off to you, Sheridan, in trying to get your overall driving to another level.

Paul and Ben will definitely try to catch up too.

talking about backmarkers.... the ones I saw is really unbelieveable...
there are one on a CRG kart, number 88 ?, being shown the blue flag
instead of making a hole for the leading pack he somehow seem try to
run others off the track!
darn! and also others trying to race with the leaders when they are clearly
already one lap down...

there really need to be penalty$ and stricter rules about the blue flag

[mlange]

I think before we point fingers, its always good to get the other side's story.

Having said that, there are always improvements that can be made.

A lot about racing protocol, i.e. overtaking, race starts, who has rights to corner, etc etc can and should be discussed by the drivers in a drivers meeting.

Its not hard to organise, just have as many drivers get together on the Friday of the race weekend to air out concerns, raise issues or clarify any protocols.